supreme court once they knocked down those walls in eastern europe that white hope stuff is gone whites dont need a hope they have white champs now heavyweights that rule boxing ever hear of the klitchkos imbraganoff amost others .kelly pavlik was a action fighter who attained a midddle weight crown . he was a good figher who was some what limiedt . most people here realize that. and as just wishing well him well no one is saying he was a white hope . just you and hopkins who says many stupid thingsPosted February 7, 2013 7:42 pm
It’s Me, Ernie
“Until you walk in a man’s shoes you don’t know his troubles.” If that is actually the case and not just another Tarkism, then how the hell do you know what went on between Lowe and Pavlik? Nah, seeing it again, it is just another Tarkism…Posted January 24, 2013 12:14 pm
You guys are talkers…
Let’s the facts speak….They don’t spin…
What does that tell us:
Kelly Pavlik was a HYPE…A HOPE….A White one!
And your a vile piece of scum, as well as an obvious fail in life.Posted January 24, 2013 8:34 am
I can see Jack Lowe being angry with Pavlik… He was making one hell of a lot of money with Kelly—and was dumped for Robert Garcia. Lowe has a right to be pissed.. Kelly has a shipload of problems brought on by money, fame, women, booze, drugs, injuries, and illnesses etc…but I don’t see that as a reason to condemn him if your name doesn’t happen to be Jack Lowe. Until you walk in a man’s shoes you don’t know his troubles.
Ok ok, good debate guys.Posted January 23, 2013 10:55 pm
I’m not trying to “negate the reality of Pavlik’s fall.” But Pavlik falls right into the same track as the other boxers that I mentioned. He is what he is. So were they.Posted January 23, 2013 8:51 pm
kid blast – yes, but alcoholism weakens the psyche and tarnishes talent. Maybe if he got humble and sought treatemnt he could regain some of the skill he squanderedPosted January 23, 2013 8:20 pm
varnish , that has nothing whatsoever to do with the discussion. We all know it’s a disease. His issues are greater than drinking. His pyche is weak. He loses; he gives up. WTF is that all about? Lots of guys lose, but they hang in there. Kessler lost and look where he is. Even Bute is still hanging in there. This guy loses twice and his world caves in. Even Wlad got waxed but he came back.Posted January 23, 2013 7:40 pm
I think what we are bumping up against is essnetially whether alcoholism is a moral faling or a disease. I think it is probably both – but people do recover and Pavlik could. Agreed, he will never be a middlewieght champ again, but he could do some business at super-middle if he cleaned up his act. Ward and Froch are bridges too far however.Posted January 23, 2013 6:59 pm
SREDMOND Makes strong points here. Aside from KP’s runup to the two JT wins, the other half of his career was marred by inability to deal with defeat, outside influences. trainer disputes, and pulling out of fights at the last minute. While he ends up with a superb record, he was not exactly the second coming. I wish him the vey best but I will not miss the drama.
And yes, he will be back within 18 months. It’s what boxers do. It’s boxing.Posted January 23, 2013 4:56 pm
Hidalgo, bringing up other boxers who lost their way on the journey does NOT negate the reality of Pavliks fall… He can drink till his hearts content but the overabundance of positive rhetoric flys in the face of commentary I have heard about ALOT of other boxers…Trying sell Kelly as a guy who is just retiring because of purely noble reasons is BOGUS in my estimation, his troubles are well publicized and if we are going to laud boxers who maintain the level of discipline and dedication it takes to compete in the sport then lets be honest about those who DON’T….I wish Kelly the best, but he is not in my eyes some guys who realized boxing was dangerous and smartly retired in order to preserve his health…He is NOT someone to emulate, he has cancelled fights and played primadonna… This reminds me of when sometime dubious characters die, people are LOATHE to critique them, I am not when appropriate.Posted January 23, 2013 2:45 pm
BTW, when I said “he’ll be back” I meant that I agree with you–he will return to the ring. I didn’t mean that he would be back as a champion.Posted January 23, 2013 2:38 pm
SRedmond, I think you are painting the wrong picture when you say that Pavlik “is not dedicated to the craft,” in the manner that you have. It’s a misleading statement–not that I don’t agree with you–now. But he was in fact, dedicated to the craft, at one time, and his possession of belts and titles, and his win-loss record speak for themselves. Most boxers come from places both tangible and intangible, that, as Kid Blast said, make them the victim of their environments–like Kelly Pavlik. Aaron Pryor and Alexis Arguello both had substance abuse problems. FMJ’s dad, who is known for his violent temper was a cocaine dealer and his mother had substance issues as well. As one article about Jr. said, “he found peace in the ring.” Hector “Macho” Camacho was convicted of burglary and also had a problem with drugs and was charged with physical abuse of one of his sons. The fabulous Mike Tyson also suffered from problems with drugs, probably due in large part to his dad who abandoned him–then his mother died when he was only sixteen. On the other hand, one of the biggest motivators and contributing factors to successful boxers earning the success that they do is the very environment which also helps to break them down, cripple and/or destroy them. There are two sides to “greatness.” Almost always there is a negative side that is every bit as great as the postive side. And more often than we’d like to see–in boxing, at least–the negative side “wins” in the long run. Kelly was a great champ–while he was–but he is no more. Fine. He isn’t a dead former champion. You know how long that list is and that it continues to grow. But yeah, he’ll be back. He’s a fighter after all.Posted January 23, 2013 2:36 pm
Yeah there is NO WAY that Pavlik is not going to make the “ill fated” comeback boxers with FAR more $$$$$$$ than him have comeback to the sport… Pavlik will be no exception..Posted January 23, 2013 1:22 pm
SREDMOND, You and I are on the same page on this one. Poor KP was the victim of his environment. Give me a break. His situation was 10 times better than what most boxers face these days.
Kid Blast, it really kills me that guys are lauding Pavlik an undisciplined athlete with a drinking problem for washinig himself up at 30 yet some tried to crucify Lennox Lewis for retiring just shy of 38 as Undisputed HW Champion owning a win over every guy he faced… The hypocrisy truly sickens me as you can see…Posted January 23, 2013 12:00 pm
SREDMOND says, ” these false narratives about who he was and who he can be make me want to vomit….”
Me too!!! :twisted:Posted January 23, 2013 11:01 am
sredmond has the beatPosted January 23, 2013 11:00 am
Pavlik is gonna comeback for money plain and simple this is an OLD story…He is 30 in two years he will only be 32 and he will have spent a good portion of his finances, anyone thinking that he is coming back because he is TRUE champion is kidding themselves.. I might sound hard of Pavlik but I actually enjoyed his fights but these false narratives about who he was and who he can be make me want to vomit…. The guy is NOT going to be a top fighter a dude like Golovkin would murder him at 160 even…. Seriously its pretty unimportant to the boxing landscape what Pav’s does he is not dedicated to the craft, basically a has been since his late 20’s.Posted January 23, 2013 10:37 am
Bill from A.A.
Anonymous , I agree. Who cares what “Kel” does? He is a major zero.Posted January 23, 2013 10:22 am
I hope Pavlik stays retired. He doesn’t have the right mindset for boxing anymore. And had the Ward fight happend he would have gotten beaten up pretty bad in my opinion. I will say though while short lived, Pavlik’s time at the top was fun. And remember in the fight with Martinez, Kelly was making a comeback in the mid rounds until Sergio busted him up and he started to have trouble seeing. Out of his two losses he was only really dominated in the Hopkins fight. And his first fight against Jermain Taylor was a classic.Posted January 23, 2013 6:38 am
no control over Kel outside of the ring ….Posted January 23, 2013 3:50 am
He is only 31 – he took some abuse from Martinez and Hopkins and a knockdown by taylor but I don’t recall him taking lots of damage – he was usually causing the damage. His “demons” (I hate that euphemism) are totally treatable – alcohlism and depression don’t have to end careers – even athletic careers – they are treatable. I just don’t get the sense that he has really sought/embraced treatment yet – but he is fairly young and what else is he going to do to earn big money?Posted January 23, 2013 2:33 am
Froch has given him opportunities but Pavliks turned them down and refused to leave his hometown. I can’t see froch calling him out now. It ain’t like he’s Cslzsghe or someone quitting at the top. None of the current supermiddle weights get any major props for beating KPPosted January 23, 2013 1:38 am
it depends if he stil has the desire to train and compete at a high level . he might have lost intrest . he is a fomer champ that has only lost 2 fights and can still make some intresting fights and make money in the process . but if he is intrested in contnuing his career the retire un retire thing isnt the way to go about it . esp if he his personal demons pulling at him . if he is still intrested he should take competive fights that he will win and wait for the money fights and see how that goes . if not retire stay retired and hopefully have oiutside intrests beside boxingPosted January 23, 2013 12:51 am
I hope Pavlik does return at some point. First took notice of him in the 1st Jermaine Taylor fight & was hooked after that. Seemed like a genuine, stand up kind of guy. If he doesn’t ever return, I have some great memories of his fights. Dude threw a hard punch!! Wish him luck in whatever he decides!Posted January 23, 2013 12:09 am
Who cares about this methcrack HEAD?? Nobody! This crack drunk is a loser!!Posted January 22, 2013 10:57 pm
I think Pavilk is gone for good. He listed all the right reasons — lack of desire, family, other/new business ventures, and most telling — health. When a fighter starts mentioning/questioning their long-term health, _along_ with the other things he listed, they’re done. Plus, Pavlik’s luster had come off with his two losses and if a year or two passes no big-name/big-money fight (something Pavlik was demanding) is going to happen.Posted January 22, 2013 7:12 pm
hookoffthejab , I’m sure Pavlik has been called a lot of names, but I’m betting “Kel” is not one of them.Posted January 22, 2013 6:44 pm
does a bear crap in the woods?Posted January 22, 2013 6:42 pm
Bill from A.A.
Of courrse he will come back. This entire deal is a big act. The guy wants to have a bit of fun, maybe get some “belts,” under him, and then announce that he once again has fire in his belly. What a load of wet steaming s. But wtf, this drink in on me, Kelly. Sluuurp, Hic. Here’s lookingat you…..:)Posted January 22, 2013 6:40 pm
It has been reported he is invested in a strip mall and all the lots are full which is a good sign. I wish him the best and hope he does stay retired.Posted January 22, 2013 6:30 pm
Why wouldn’t he return??? Never been stopped.. Knocked down once.. Talks as clear as a bell.. Two defeats to ATG fighters.. Kelly hasn’t put the training Robert Garcia is giving him to good use yet … Your footwork is getting better, your defense is better, your feints are better, your hooks are getting shorter and sharper. Why retire now just because a major fight blew out? … It’s a big disappointment, but suck it up.
It’s easier to control a drinking habit when you’re in training camp for a major fight the world is waiting to see.. But when training camp comes to an abrupt end because the fight is cancelled that’s an empty feeling.. Pavlik should look at what his trainer’s brother Mikey Garcia is doing and take inspiration from that.. Mikey is 25, works really hard, and is probably the best featherweight in the world … You can’t have a better role model.Posted January 22, 2013 4:51 pm
either way whatever is spoken of Kelly of late hasnt been of the positive nature it has been a long time since all we discussed when it came to Kel was his boxing he has what it takes to up there with the best i for one would like to see him continue but at the end of the day theres only one person who should be making Kels decisions ………Posted January 22, 2013 4:11 pm
Come backs in boxing are like drunks in a bar at 2 in the morning on a sat.night…it will happen.Alot of boxers arent wise with their money…and if you put vices on top of that come backs will happen.Plus not to many of these guys have enginering degrees…so forth so come backs happen pretty often.Posted January 22, 2013 3:24 pm
Pavliks coming, back 1million or 500k to get hit for his name will be too much for him… This dude is NOT staying away from age 30 onward… He will say the usual, rejuventated, focused, the fire’s back… What the hell else is he going to do? and once the requisite divorce hits the chick will take some of his $$$$$$$$$$$$$….. See you in a year or 2 Kelly!Posted January 22, 2013 2:36 pm
In a sport…any sport that demands your body to be at it’s ultimate peak, it becomes almost impossible to come back from an bad injury of some sort. Alcoholism, although not an “injury”, is in-fact a bad injury to the whole body as apposed to an isolated part. He will need to train really hard and dedicate himself X2 in the ring just be good. I think he can do it(come back to champ status) but he needs to dig DEEP within himself and do it…. JUST SAYIN’Posted January 22, 2013 2:31 pm
Pavlik was bit of a phenom , didn’t look like much but he went alright, came across as normal, someone you could relate to, had his vices, should be proud of his accomplishments in the sport,Posted January 22, 2013 1:58 pm