By Mike Samuels
22.07 - They’re still biting at the reputation of Lewis. They’re still swinging for the fences at yours truly, and now with Vernon Forrest’s complete performance against the Sugar man in the books, a whole new fire has been lit. One fan even goes as far as questioning Ali’s legacy! And what about Butterball and Grandpa Holmes? It’s time to let the fans speak!
Remember Leonard Vs Hearns I ? The solution is simple. Shane (being smaller) needs to get rough and get inside without getting tied up by Vernon who held on the inside most of the fight. Circling away from Vernon's right hand power punch and closing behind the jab with combinations of many rapid hooks and side-angled uppercuts to the body first and later in the fight, to the body and up to the head. Remember the windmill of hooks and uppercuts thrown by a beaten Leonard with the jab inflicted closed eye? If we see the same successful holding by Vernon when Shane moves inside in the second fight. It will be a mirror image of the first without question. Clearly, Shane is too small to win on the outside. Shane has all the tools to beat Vernon and used few of them in the first fight. Look for a speedy and much rougher Mosley to come in with a wealth of knowledge from the study of his classic mistakes (fighting flat footed, moving into his opponents power, moving straight back away from punches and other amateurish mistakes.... etc) he and his corner made in the first fight. I feel he will have a tough fight and will dominant early and late in the fight. This time it is Vernon who will look like he does not understand what is going on.
Mosley doesn’t have the tools to beat Vernon Forrest. Styles make fights and Vernon’s style will beat Mosley’s style every time. It’s kind of similar to what "Sugar" Ray Leonard said: "I will beat Roberto Duran every time." And I believe after watching the second fight (a fight in which Mosley was a lot rougher and got on the inside, but was unable to stop himself from being tied up by Forrest) I am convinced that Vernon Forrest was highly overrated as a fighter, and now the media and boxing public is eating crow for ever counting him out – especially out of the rematch after he dominated Mosley the first time.
Look for Jack Mosley to be fired. I think that Shane needs a new corner man, someone to help him adjust his game a little bit. I didn’t see Mosley do anything different the first time (besides circle once in a great while). The only thing he did was get closer, but once inside he wasn’t able to throw two or three-punch combinations. Forrest is able to make Mosley look ordinary. Some fighters do that to greats, and it’s definitely going to be a long road back for the Sugar man, but he can never be counted out.
Don’t feel bad for thinking Mosley would be able to do something different, because you aren’t the only one. But now there is no question as to who the better fighter is, and it’s going to be interesting to see what Mosley does from this point on.
Dear mike, I think Vernon Forrest is the next legend in this sport. He has the fire in his eye, and the ability in the ring to become great maybe one of the all time greats! A "real deal" for the new millennium so to speak No matter what I think we’ll be hearing the name Vernon Forrest for sometime to come. What do you think mike?
To be honest, I have always liked Forrest but I never would have picked him over Mosley in the first fight. Now after watching him handle Shane-O without barely any problems in two fights (not to mention the Olympics), I have become a true believer that he will do some great things in the sport. If he stays at 147lbs I don’t think there is a single fighter who can beat him right now – not after coming off two wins over the Sugar man.
At 154lbs, well, things could be interesting. It’s possible for Forrest to meet the winner of Vargas/De la Hoya (but now with De la Hoya’s belt situation and the way the belts are tossed around, WHO KNOWS what will happen). I can’t even begin to make a fight prediction on that one, but Forrest is a guy who will not start to make ANY weight class he chooses interesting.
Please post this comment as many Ali/ boxing fans need to know the truth.
Many regard him as the number one fighter but I feel this is largely based today on his political exploits and his popularity worldwide. Lets just think for a minute he was a regular Joe or even a Mike Tyson like figure. I will go through his career. His corner cheated when they cut his glove so he wouldn’t get knocked out by Henry Cooper (it would in todays terms be like Frank Bruno knocking out Tyson; which would not happen). If you've watched Ali as a neutral one would know he lost to Norton 3 times, Beat Liston (who at least in one if not both of the fights threw the fight) a 90's similarity of his achievement over liston would be Lewis vs. McCall 2 who because Lewis is not adored the fight was regarded as a joke. 'Smokin' or 'Joking' Joe Frazier was over rated and knocked out by Foreman and Norton. A 9-fight novice Leon Spinks also beat Ali. Had any of todays big heavyweights faced him he'd have had no chance; even the smaller ones like Tyson and Holyfield would have definitely KO'd him (ps: Holyfield is the greatest heavyweight ever 4 time champ soon to be 5. People say Lewis is boring please... anyone who struggles to sleep just watch Ali Frazier 2 or 3.
Regards Sandeep, Neil and Jamie Acorn.
I appreciate your view, but I gotta’ TOTALLY DISAGREE, brotha’. Muhammad Ali is one of the greatest (If not the greatest) heavyweights of all-time. And yes, it’s true that he made a big impact on the media and political points of the world, but as a fan of boxing you cannot use that as a shot on Ali. Ali fought damn near everyone in his era (if not everyone), and he displayed one of the greatest chins for a heavyweight champion ever.
You are too focused on the negative aspects of his career, and it sucks because it drains the love out of the sport for most people – including yourself. Yeah, Ali’s corner "cut his glove" and that probably saved him from a beating, BUT that act alone (when I can name at least twenty-five other instances with other fighters, INCLUDING your boy Holyfield) does not discredit what he did for the sport, and the greats he defeated. It’s okay to think that he got a few gift decisions in his day, but that’s just part of the sport. He beat Norton once in my opinion, but why get so heated over that fight when Holyfield has gotten GIFT DECISIONS over the likes of Lennox Lewis (Please don’t tell me that fight was a draw) and John Ruiz in their first battle (Ruiz took it to him!). I don’t mean to fire back at Holyfield because he is an all-time great, but just as you give him props, you should not neglect to give Ali his share of love.
But, let me get this straight. You think Ali’s first win over Liston wasn’t impressive? Bro, I’m not aware of your age, but I KNOW that if you were back in 1964 and you had to pick a winner, you WOULD HAVE gone with Liston. Sheesh! And tell me, how is Joe Frazier overrated? Is it because he lost to Foreman? That’s the only JOKE I can think of. Did you see Foreman in his day? The guy was TEN TIMES the animal Mike Tyson was in the eighties, and Muhammad Ali (out of his prime) shocked the world when he not only beat Foreman, but KNOCKED HIM out.
And now you’re calling the Ali-Frazier trilogy BORING? Oh, man, oh man. Open your eyes, bro! Those three fights are three of the GREATEST fights ever witnessed by anyone in any era of boxing. Nowadays fights are complete jokes compared to those three alone. So do me a favor, get your hands on those fights and watch them without letting any of your dislike get in the way of your opinion.
Big, big heavyweight fight happening soon, Larry Holmes vs. Butterbean. This fight is sure to have a huge impact on the heavyweight division, possibly shaping it for the rest of the year. But seriously, I think this is a really bad idea for Holmes. He has had a great career, and it is pointless for him to take this fight, which he is most probably going to lose. Holmes has more money than he know what to do with, so that's not the case for the fight. It's a respect thing, but a lose could cause Holmes to lose some of his respect he has earned for a great career. Butterbean is way more active, as Holmes has been retired for quite some time, and I honestly don't see Holmes lasting past the 5th round. Good luck Holmes, you're going to need it.
You’re right when you say Holmes doesn’t need the money. And although he hasn’t fought a serious competitor in God knows how long (not to mention that he’s as old as my grandpa), Butterbean hasn’t exactly been fighting top class fighters. Holmes has the experience, edge, and possibly the desire (knowing that if he loses to Butterbean it could tarnish his career totally) to take it to Butterbean. So I’m going out on a limp here: Holmes by UD.
Dear Mike,
I hope this mail finds you well; I’m an avid boxing fan and beginning to start taking my own boxing career seriously. One simple though very common question. . Do you think anyone could defeat Mike Tyson, any one whosoever, during his peak? Someone like Lewis I hope you think not. But anyone,
Ali, Foreman, Marciano, Louis?
Merci, regards and whatnot, Ben. I’m rising; watch out for me in a few years.
I get this question a lot. I think Tyson was great and exciting for boxing in the eighties, but I also feel that the likes of Joe Louis, The Rock, Ali, and even a Joe Frazier could beat "Iron" Mike. A lot of those guys weren’t big heavyweights, so weight isn’t a big deal. And if you look at the wars those guys have been in (Marciano and his career, Frazier and Ali’s three fight series), it’s plain as day to know that they had great chins. But most importantly, all those guys had HEART. And that is something Tyson is missing.
Mike Samuels can be reached at Tyson180@aol.com for comments.
