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The trouble is as the years go on your achievements diminish with time .Modern day great,maybe not,but he is up there in the mix….

Posted July 24, 2013 7:46 am 

Exiled Yank

The ESB – I haven’t gone anywhere and there are only a handful of posters that have been around longer than me!

Posted July 23, 2013 9:39 pm 

The ESB Post Recorder

RAY GORDON REID , when Pavlick retired, I hear Old Yank offed himself!!

Tumbo moved to Mexico and raises cattle.

MRBILL uses Facebook

Tark and Kid Blast are still here and so is Fight Aficionado

But a new regime of posters have swept in.

Times change.

Posted July 21, 2013 10:46 pm 


Please, AB. You can do this sort of revisionism to any boxing great’s resume. The fact is Froch has had one of THE toughest, consistent string of opponents of any active fighter. (Note: No catchweights, or fighting guys moving up.) And except for two fights, he’s emerged victorious, and one of the loses he got revenge. Yes, you can argue about a decision here or there, you can do that nearly any fighter, but even in those he was very competitive. Hell, all those guys you listed as “greats” had fights they were less than impressive in, or had opponents who were suspect.

Posted July 21, 2013 9:41 pm 


A modern day great? Errr… No.

He isn’t even one of the best UK super middleweights. Calzaghe, Benn, Eubank, Collins, and Watson are all far superior to him.

Froch’s “brilliant” résumé is hugely overrated. Let’s take a look:

Taylor – Completely past it, and he was easily beating Froch until he gassed.
Dirrell – He was robbed. Plain and simple. Froch did not win that fight.
Kessler (first meeting) – He was past it at this stage, yet Froch still lost.
Abraham – This guy was NEVER a great fighter. Not an impressive win at all.
Johnson – He was approximately 176 years old at the time.
Ward – Embarrassed Froch badly. Made him look like an novice.
Bute – He was clearly affected by the atmosphere. Would beat Froch in Canada.
Mack – Never a good fighter. Like the Abraham fight, not impressive.
Kessler (second meeting) – Badly past it by now. Still, it was close. I had it a draw.

So no, Froch isn’t a great, not in this or any other era.

Posted July 21, 2013 5:25 pm 


problly got banned

Posted July 21, 2013 3:36 pm 


we had a group of people on here what happen

Posted July 21, 2013 3:33 pm 



Posted July 21, 2013 3:19 pm 


Did you watch any of the Super 6? You can dispute a victory in there, but the man ended up second –second only to one of the very top pound-for-pound guys in the sport today (Andre Ward). That ain’t too shabby. Here’s the thing, seems no one wants to crown any active fighter a “great.” But once they retire, a some years go by, then people will fondly look back at their career and say something like, ‘yea, that Carl Froch was a hell of a fighter — he’d kick the asses of all these new young fighters today.”

Posted July 21, 2013 3:17 pm 



Posted July 21, 2013 3:16 pm 

Squared-Circle Real Talk (a.k.a. The Lion King of Beat Street)

Not even close to a modern day great. But maybe great inside the little island of Britain.

Posted July 21, 2013 3:04 pm 


Yet Carl fought a MUCH tougher list of fighters than Calz did.

Posted July 21, 2013 2:52 pm 


Carl is not at the level of Calzaghe.

Posted July 21, 2013 10:17 am 


With Calz, you have to wonder if he had fought an in-their prime (much younger versions) or B-Hop and Jones, if he wouldn’t have been stopped after he was knocked down. Especially against a young Jones, who after putting down a hurt opponent, could fire off a barrage of 10-20 unanswerable, hurtful, punches.

Posted July 21, 2013 9:43 am 


I think when Froch’s career is closed out, some time has passed, historians will look back and appreciate all that he has been able to accomplish. Yeah, he didn’t win them all — very few of the “greats” did — but except for the Ward fight (remember Duran didn’t look so good against Hearns) he nearly always got it done, or at the least was very competitive. That makes for a “great” in my eyes (note: I’m not a big fan of Froch, I’m just being truthful).

Posted July 21, 2013 9:22 am 

Exiled Yank

Froch may be a modern great in GB, but in only GB. Calz is a true great and I don’t see Froch beating him. Calz was getting older when Froch was coming up, but Froch is not near the talen JC was. Look what Ward did to him, JC would have done the same or even more. Sheesh.

Posted July 21, 2013 9:06 am 

Exiled Yank

You must be kidding me!!! Froch is awesome and definitely one of the top in the 168 division this era, but greatness is different. Hop, MP, FM and others can take that honor. Not even Ward can be considered a modern day great and he’s beaten the best 168 has to offer, including Froch!

Posted July 21, 2013 9:03 am 


Mike “The Body Snatcher” McCallum vs Micheal Watson

Posted July 21, 2013 4:47 am 


Nigel Benn V Iran Barclay

Posted July 21, 2013 4:41 am 


Gerald McClellan : A Fallen Warrior

Posted July 21, 2013 4:27 am 


“Michael Watson – The People’s Champion” (2011 Documentary)

Posted July 21, 2013 4:25 am 


I agree Dirrell beat Froch.

Posted July 21, 2013 2:19 am 


Ted…. Leonard, Hearns, Hagler, and Duran had a little click…

They didn’t fight Mike McCallum… Michael Nunn… Nigel Benn… James Toney… Julian Jackson… Reggie Johnson… or Sumbu Kalambay.

There it is… Remember, Hearns was younger than McCallum

Posted July 21, 2013 2:18 am 


“BTW… Froch has one loss… He whipped Kessler both times… easy.”-Nope . He rightfully has 2 LOSSES except the 1st LOSS should be to Dirrell not Kessler.

Posted July 21, 2013 1:17 am 


While not the flashiest or the most talented, Froch, nearly always got it done — and most importantly he did it against the very best in the division, and in rapid fire sequence. So I would vote yes, as he would likely give any “great” a hell of a fight.

Posted July 20, 2013 11:18 pm 

Kid Blast

Froch fits in nicely as he is more a banger than a boxer. But he can be both as he proved against AA.

I like Froch better than Calzaghe because of his level of opposition and willingness to fight anyone.

Posted July 20, 2013 9:56 pm 

Kid Blast

Tark, here it is:

Chris “Simply the Best” Eubank (45-5-2) fought from 1986 to 1998; Carl “The Cat” Thompson (34-6) duked from 1986 until 2005; Nigel “Dark Destroyer” Benn (42-5-1) did his fearsome work from 1987 to 1996; Michael “The Force” Watson (25-4-1) toiled from 1984 until 1991. They traveled on the U.K. Expressway, a uniquely fast, ferocious, and furious pathway. They had a lot in common, as they were, first and foremost, warriors in the true sense of the word. They would risk their own well-being to render havoc on an opponent, and in many instances, the price paid was terribly high.

Like Leonard, Hearns, Hagler, and Duran, they often fought each other. Watson lost to Eubank twice but beat Benn by shocking TKO in 1989. Benn went 0-1-1 with Eubank with their savage draw in 1993—a fight that was England’s answer to Hagler-Hearns—being fought in front of 42,000 wild fans. Thompson beat Eubank twice during his exciting chill-or-be-chilled career. But it wasn’t so much that they had good records or were world champions at one time or another as it was the way in which they fought and never left anything in the ring.

Posted July 20, 2013 9:38 pm 


No Ted…. They sucked. Benn was the dirtiest fighter I’ve ever seen, and no defender. He was easy get out, but Tommy Hearns did duck him anyway. Tommy was a little chinny and he avoided big punchers who could box or brawl well. Eubank didn’t want to fight Roy Jones — he said so many times.

If you’re a professional at the world level, you shouldn’t take an option of picking and chosing your opponents. You should take the fights the fans will most enjoy … and give deserving boxers a shot.

Posted July 20, 2013 6:26 pm 

Kid Blast

Tark says, “Who remembers Eubank and Benn??? What did they ever do??? They certainly couldn’t box or defend well.”

I sure do and they could “fight” as well as anyone. They both belong on the IBHOF.

Tark, you were kidding, right?

Posted July 20, 2013 5:35 pm 

Kid Blast


Posted July 20, 2013 5:32 pm 


The super middle div. is a pretty good div. and at this point Froch is the #2 guy in it.So to call him modern day great is okay or a very good fighter at this time is fair overall.

Posted July 20, 2013 5:24 pm 


Top? Didnt he lose to a shot Kessler, green as grass Dirrell and proved not to belong in the same ring as the real Top guy….Ward? Come on FFS

Posted July 20, 2013 3:36 pm 



Posted July 20, 2013 2:57 pm 


TARK, Froch was a tough fight for Calzaghe, but a definite loss i dout. Calzaghe was loved in Great Brittian at the time and any close decision would have gone to Calzaghe. Calzaghe at the time was trying to perpare for retirement by maximizing his financial potential. Calzaghe was being recognized world wide not so much for Froch at the time. Calzaghe was going after other fighter with world wide recognition.

Posted July 20, 2013 2:37 pm 


JeffC, I’m not bashing Froch you have alittle more time in boxing than I do, I just have a lowly 42 years of enjoyment with boxing. I can respect your opinion, but because of my comment you went with the having knowlegde of boxing. I was just commenting on what Ward and Froch themselves had said Froch after a fight and Ward while commentating. It was Froch who decided not to take the immediate fight that he has the highest possiblty of a loss. Not that Froch is ducking, he is Maximizing his financial potenial. Which as I stated before is smart. We as fan tend to say this fighter ducks no one, all fighters work their way to the top and make good business decision to get a shot at being a champion. With that being said all elite SMW took the high road of fighting anyone they put in front of them when they fought in the super 6. So, in my opinion every fighter that participated deserves the respct of the boxing fans. The fighters of the super 6 put on a great show for all of boxing, I just wish we could have more turnament of this sort.

Posted July 20, 2013 2:29 pm 


OMG cut it out

Posted July 20, 2013 1:59 pm 


Froch is a very good fighter that has a very unorthodox style. He has a huge fighting heart and always gives his all. He comes to fight but lacks defense, but makes it up with his spirited effort. Is he a modern great? No, I think he can give anyone a tough fight, but he doesn’t have the extra gear or skills to beat the best. He’s very entertaining and will always draw fans, but when you think of great fighters, he’s a notch below. I enjoy his fights and his quiet ego. And his wife is gorgeous and truly supportive of her husband.

Posted July 20, 2013 1:42 pm 


froch bute 2

Posted July 20, 2013 1:02 pm 



Seriously deluded!!! “Froch cant box” what a laughable statement. Froch isn’t where he is from being fighter only.

Posted July 20, 2013 1:02 pm 


Badly deluded fool who picked Oosthuizen to beat Gonzales when he knew little about either fighter… That’s Boxtra

Posted July 20, 2013 12:40 pm 


I have respect for FROCH but he is not a modern-day GREAT. He can’t beat Andre Ward!!! GREATNESS is ME!!!

Posted July 20, 2013 12:23 pm 

steve m

I would be surprised to see ward come to England, americans like to fight in their backyards, seems the british crowds are a little too hostile for them, never mind, but ward would beat froch anyway, too skilful. Hats off to froch, he isn’t a boxer you would typically mould yourself on, technically, but he’s made of steel!!

Posted July 20, 2013 12:23 pm 


Froch DID have a “big name” Everybody in the UK knew Froch was a young undefeated 168-pound threat to Calzaghe.. It was the biggest fight going in all of the UK … It was a freakin’ BLOCKBUSTER!!

Calzaghe’s thing was preserving his “0” at all cost.

That’s why he fought Peter Manfredo when he could have made 10 times as much fighting Froch… Same reason Hatton ducked Witter…

Massive box office — but a certain loss.

Posted July 20, 2013 12:17 pm 


Urone2; Thank you for your opinion of me, everyone is entitled to have an opinion, but please don’t question me knowing anything about boxing, I have been involved in boxing for 50 years, so I hope I know a little, maybe I’m wrong. What I was trying to get across was this, Froch fights anybody they put in front of him, if it’s better for him to try to pick his spot against Ward,so be it, Ward certainly picks his time and place. It is not that I am a die hard british boxing fan, I do not live in Great Britain, I just try to be fair to all the fighters I comment on.Best wishes to you and keep commenting, but try to look at it from all sides.

Posted July 20, 2013 12:11 pm 


TARK, Calzaghe didn’t fight Froch because of exposure and it being a tough fight. If Froch had a big name the would pay a big purse Calzaghe would have fought him. Calzaghe didn’t get the fights with Hopkins and RJJ for the same reason. Calzaghe would have been a tough fight with a small payday. Calzaghe was told to increase his U.S. exposure to get the fight but he waited.

Posted July 20, 2013 12:05 pm 


JeffC, I hate when a fighter fans claim to know boxing. If you notice what I was saying is that he opted to take Ward on at a later date. Froch being smart is going to make his money while on the high of his career before revisiting the toughest fight of his career for possibly his biggest purse. You sound like a fighter fan that love Froch, and did not listen, or refused to hear when he said he will take a few fights in between before he fights Ward again. I don’t believe and top level fighters are scared unlike some of the fools on here. They try to wait for the best time to fight them, if its a very tough fight they try to maximize the reward. I wish you fighter fan would understand this.

Posted July 20, 2013 12:00 pm 


I know Forch would have beaten Calzaghe… Calzaghe knew it too… Are you going to fight somebody who you think can beat you if you can avoid him??? Forch didn’t fight Adonis Stevenson when he was his mandatory… He could have another fight with Ward right now, for the asking — IN ENGLAND!!! He doesn’t want it. That’s your answer.

Posted July 20, 2013 11:49 am 


Any true boxing fan, that knows anything about the boxing game, must, I repeat MUST, respect Carl Froch,why? because he fights all the top super middleweights in the world,time after time, he ducks nobody, don’t tell me he is ducking Ward, he fought him, he lost, no doubt about it, he didn’t cry about it , he continues to fight top ranked fighters, and win. Could he have beaten Calzhge? who knows, and who will ever know, one thing is for certain he would have given his all, as he always does,he is a credit to Britain and British boxing, it’s a pity he never got this coverage earlier in his career,then maybe he could have got much bigger purses than some of these cry baby,once a year fighters, who continue to fool the public. Just my opinion.

Posted July 20, 2013 11:13 am 


Andre Ward already said he would entertain the idea of going to england to fight Froch. Remember Froch put that fight off until later in his career. He didn’t duck but I think he’s not ready to lose again, and the Keseller fight is not all that great. In the last fight Keseller showed that he had no leg left on which to operate. If they fought again it would be an easy fight for Froch. Froch is a great fighter in his own rigth, but he knows where the tar meets the road and that’s at Ward.

Posted July 20, 2013 10:29 am 


Just die Ernie Enema drinker… That’s the best thing you could possibly do.

Posted July 20, 2013 10:27 am 


@Hugh Jardon…. Calzaghe fought the inept Peter Manfredo, who nobody in the UK wanted to see him fight..

Froch had been calling him out like crazy.. EVERYBODY in the UK wanted to see Calzaghe fight Froch.. It was a monster money fight like Hatton-Witter would have been.

When Julio Cesar Chavez was looking for somebody easy to beat??? Guess what??? He fought Peter Manfredo. But at least he fought Martinez at last. He took his beating and got the money.

Calzaghe should have done the same with Froch.

Posted July 20, 2013 10:25 am 

It’s Me, Ernie

I didn’t miss any of the resident Tard’s hot air. Picked up right where I left off. I see you are still posting a lot of nothing know-it-all garbage that has no substance. poor lonely bastard…

Posted July 20, 2013 10:15 am 


Calzaghe refused to fight Froch… The kid hit too hard and was too tough for him. Calz picked his spots very well.. Froch didn’t fight mandatory challenger Adonis Stevenson. It was a little bit the same scenario –punches way too hard and too tough.

In fact you’ve had a click at 168 nobody can break through.. Rodriguez and Stevenson both went to 175 because their challenges went begging. Pavlik got fed up and quit. That’s not the way to do it, but if you can’t get a fight? … Why not? … There’s other things to do.

Posted July 20, 2013 10:06 am 


froch is a good fighter but a crap boxer. gets hit too easily and far too often. a totally shot and gun shy jermain taylor was on his way to an easy victory over froch when he got stopped with 10secs remaining in the last round. froch is extremely durable and tough but more suited to mma than boxing. THE GREAT JOE CALZAGHE would easily have beaten froch and froch knew it,and thats why he was always asking frank warren WHEN IS JOE MOVING UP TO LIGHT HAEVY WEIGHT…..froch always knew CALZAGHE had his number. CALZAGHE WAS TOO
QUICK,TOO ELUSIVE,AND THREW TOO MANY PUNCHES FOR froch TO HANDLE. Look how easily andre ward beat froch. That type of boxer doesn’t suit frochs style,he prefers an opponent to stand in front of him and have a scrap,not a slick

Posted July 20, 2013 8:48 am 


To be honest I would pick Calzaghe over Froch prime for prime – but Froch has done more with his career for me.

Posted July 20, 2013 8:12 am 


Well first carl froch should win over groves and he will have a hard night aginst mikkel kessler if he say yes to the fight. I hope they will make a nummer 3 of that fight. But wolud like to see Kessler vs Robert stielgest that would be good as well and kessler is not the type of fighter that should call it a day with a lose, he to good for that I think. Carl Froch great not as great as Calzaghe though but he´s a dame good fighter for sure.

Posted July 20, 2013 7:49 am 


Articles like this is the reason Carl Froch is turning in to big headed tool,a exciting to watch tough guy a bit like Nigel Benn,yes,a great N O WAY.

Posted July 20, 2013 6:28 am 


Yes he’s right up there with Benn and Eubank and Calzaghe, actually more so in my book,there’s NEVER been a British fighter who’s faced such tough opposition fight after fight after fight.

Posted July 20, 2013 5:41 am 

Mick the Marmalizer

“If” he beats ward in a rematch then he’s cemented his legacy. The problem is of course getting Ward out of the USA. Froch is without doubt the UK’s #1 P4P!

Posted July 20, 2013 5:28 am 


Great fighter, who has only one (for him) unsolvable problem: Andre Ward. Not even in his backyard (if – and that is a big IF – Ward would accept to fight outside the US), the Cobra would be able to win vs. Ward. But Froch is the more exciting fighter because he’s an all-in-guy, a warrior, while Ward is a much more controlled, technically skilled boxer with high ring intelligence. It’s always worth the admission price to see Froch fight, and we should be happy that he’s around.

Posted July 20, 2013 4:13 am 


Tark he can box, look at the Abraham fight again sir, disciplined boxing for 12 rounds.

Posted July 20, 2013 4:04 am 


Yes the Cobra is a true throwback fighter, enjoy him will he’s still fighting.

Posted July 20, 2013 4:03 am 

terror tim

I used to rag on Froch for being slow and with no footwork. He has consistently stepped up his game and improved with almost every outing. Ward is the best Super Middleweight in the world (possibly the 2nd best fighter too) but Froch is very very good. He has very clever movement and his hands are accurate and fast enough. His power is known as is his toughness. Still a ton of fights I would love to see him take but the best thing about Froch is that he ducks no one. The string of fights he had vs top contenders surpasses anyone in recent years. As a boxing fan I don’t know how you can’t like this guy even though I once wasn’t a fan.

Posted July 20, 2013 3:39 am 

Hugh Jardon

He will always be in calzaghe shadow, always. Why would you fight someone that would bring thousands rather than millions, nobody ducked.

Posted July 20, 2013 3:30 am 


As an American I have nuff respect for Froch. He is the most entertaining but not most talked about super middleweight. Andre Ward gets more press here. Regardless I’d like to see him fight GGG, Chavez, & Adonis Stevenson before he retires. I agree he doesn’t box he fights. Haye fights once a decade so who cares & Calzaghe became popular & then retired suddenly. Froch reps the UK the best to me

Posted July 20, 2013 2:19 am 


BTW… Froch has one loss… He whipped Kessler both times… easy.

Posted July 20, 2013 1:44 am 


Froch is a great fighter…

This pundit says…., “Will Froch be remembered as fondly as the likes of Eubank, Benn, Lewis, Hatton and Calzaghe.”

Who remembers Eubank and Benn??? What did they ever do??? They certainly couldn’t box or defend well.

Ricky Hatton was a walking disaster looking for a place to happen.. Didn’t Ricky get knocked out in 3 of his last 5 fights??? Wasn’t he a lot younger than Froch at the time he was racking up KO losses???

Froch can’t box.. But one thing he can do is fight. And he doesn’t have a China-chin like Hatton.. Froch is right up there with Lewis, Haye, and Calzaghe, as Britons best ATG fighters.. Calzaghe ducked Froch, and neither could box worth a damn … so I rank Froch above JC.

Posted July 20, 2013 1:41 am 


He’s really good. Even a A+ fighter in my book but not a modern day great.

Posted July 20, 2013 12:16 am 

It’s Me, Ernie


Posted July 19, 2013 11:13 pm 

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Carl Froch, A modern day great?

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