eh?Posted December 3, 2013 3:01 pm
Some people on here have a lot to learn about a legacy. You don’t take it away from a boxer by turning away and getting stopped and crying about being robbed, especially when you don’t have the record to back it up…Groves should seal his own legacy first …go fight the guy who has been calling him out if he is so hot for a rematch..Don’t go stealing it….Posted December 3, 2013 2:52 pm
PEEJ…, “This is why they have a 10 count.”
They stop fights when somebody is badly hurt.. That’s only right.. They have a 10-count to get you out if you’re having a hard time getting up.. They have the neutral corner rule to prevent you from standing over a fallen fighter… They have the mandatory-8 count so the referee has enough time to check your ability to continue if you bounce up early… Even after the 8-count the referee will have you take steps toward him if he thinks you’re hurt..
The Kovalevj-Sillakh fight should have been stopped when Sillakh got back to his feet, badly shaken… After the mandatory the referee made him walk—and his walk was unsteady as Hell.
Sillakh was gone, but took 3 more unnecessary punches… It was a championship fight — so that is what some referees do.Posted December 3, 2013 3:01 am
Not sure about that Groves was gassed out and defiantly on his way to being knocked out. He did throw return punches but they were pity pat as he staggered around the ring exhausted. Froch would have teed off possible causing serious damage. groves big chance was in the first he should have finished Froch a more experienced fighter would have.Posted December 3, 2013 12:45 am
@Mr Nonsense: Which brother? Wayne or Lee? I mean, if it’s Lee’s trousers he’s been wearing I can see your point, but if he’s been wearing Wayne’s that surely indicates we *should* invade Syria, no?Posted December 2, 2013 8:24 pm
Rumour has it that Froch has been seen out and about wearing his brother’s trousers – so no, we shouldn’t invade Syria.Posted December 2, 2013 5:42 pm
i love carl froch but his legacy will definatly be tarnished if he doesnt fight groves again. i think groves has finished froch with that fight and will be suprised if froch is the same fighter now. froch has got to fight groves if he wants to keep his reputation.
The idea Froch’s reputation relies on a rematch with GG is laughable given his resume of fights in the last 5-6 years, GG deserves a rematch but i dont think he will get one unless Froch cant get the big fights he wants in vegas against the likes of Ward,Chavez or GGG.Posted December 2, 2013 4:59 pm
Frochs legacy will not be tarnished if he does not rematch Groves. But Groves does deserve a rematchPosted December 2, 2013 4:23 pm
Great article, very rare for ESB these days. The author is right, Froch’s legacy will be damaged if he refuses to rematch. Also, claiming Groves cannot cut it at World level makes Froch look like a moron. Groves totally outclassed him up until the 9th. No money fighting Ward, Golovkin would punch holes in Froch.Posted December 2, 2013 3:47 pm
Froch wants no part of Groves. Losing to Ward doesn’t hurt as much.Posted December 2, 2013 3:17 pm
The people who claim Froch refusing Groves a rematch someone affects his legacy are the sorts that talk a lot and know very little, the same ones who claim Calzaghe ‘dominated’ Hopkins or that Groves ‘win’ against DeGale wasn’t controversial. They think boxing is a popularity contest.
Froch repeatedly faced the best in his division on run of fights possibly unparalled in recent times. Beating Groves is not even in Froch’s top 5 wins. Getting stopped by Froch after winning the early rounds will be one of the highlights of Groves’ career.Posted December 2, 2013 2:43 pm
This was a terrible stoppage. This does deserve a rematch. I am not a Groves fan but he definitely should of been able to continue and wait for the KO to happen before the ref stepped in. Bad stoppagePosted December 2, 2013 2:40 pm
Somebody change the record! How long is Groves and his little band of whiners going to keep whingeing? The ref already saved Groves from being stopped in the 8th round,just after Groves had illegally hit Froch on the back of the head purposely TWICE,Froch had Groves hurt and on the ropes,landed a big shot,Groves looked badly wobbled and the ref jumps in,parts them,and warns FROCH.Nobody seems to complain about the refs actions there.Posted December 2, 2013 1:56 pm
BILLY NO MEDALS ALL AMERICAN BOY
f@k of brucey,your opinion dont count,this sites for warriors,not wormsPosted December 2, 2013 1:09 pm
This is why they have a 10 count. This needs to be utilized more. Stopping fights prematurely is getting terrible. These people know what they signed up for. They are gonna end up turning boxing into what the NFL is turning into.Posted December 2, 2013 1:04 pm
groves will never beat froch,you need more than 7 rounds of gas.Posted December 2, 2013 12:47 pm
I sense there’s some divergence of opinion on this one ;-).Posted December 2, 2013 12:39 pm
BILLY NO MEDALS ALL AMERICAN BOY
MERRY XMASS BRUCEY,YOUR WELCOME IN BRADFORD ANYTIME,THE KEBABS ARE ACE,PLUS YOU NEED TO TOP UP YOUR ACNE,Posted December 2, 2013 12:34 pm
Groves tried so hard to appear confident before the fight – it looked desperate. I hardly think he’s going to be psychologically stronger for the re-match. Froch in 6 or 7 if there is (I hope so).Posted December 2, 2013 12:21 pm
Utter flim-flam. Total hogwash. Laughable hyperbole. Froch first ballot HOF for sure. The dude is approaching 40. Groves, a complete c*** in buildup, was TKO-ed, badly hurt, caught on ropes, Froch landing at will. Deal with it. Move on Carl.Posted December 2, 2013 12:14 pm
billy no medals all american prick. froch owes him nout. where you from bradford by any chance. LOL.Posted December 2, 2013 11:50 am
george groves-the peoples super middleweight championPosted December 2, 2013 11:32 am
Someone is assuming my identity! Although I have no idea why lolPosted December 2, 2013 11:32 am
Absurd stoppage. Of course Groves deserves the rematch. It should be mandated. The ref should have worried more about Froch hitting Groves behind the head than whether to stop the fight way, way prematurely.Posted December 2, 2013 10:51 am
Boxing barlow,is realy ken barlow of coryPosted December 2, 2013 10:43 am
I have given my views exclusively to fighthype website to explain why it was a fair stoppage by the ref. Read what I said to my charge Andre Ward about what Froch was doing and why we are very happy to give him a rematch.Posted December 2, 2013 9:53 am
Marilyn 13 has the beat.Posted December 2, 2013 9:48 am
Froch not giving Groves a rematch, is like Kessler being outgunned by one of his fellow danes, and going on to meet an age old Hopkins, for the money.
In a rematch -Groves by either Ko or winning all rounds, Froch, like Kessler, is over the hill now.
I don’t think Froch is interested in a rematch.Posted December 2, 2013 9:39 am
Not much honour in a rematch; if anything it’s likely to tarnish the peformance Groves just put on, if a less complacent Froch puts on a more emphatic show against a less confident Groves. If Groves moves on he can always talk about the night he nearly beat Froch and how Froch ran from the rematch… which has got to be better than another loss which makes everyone wonder what the fuss was about in the first place…
Lots of money in a rematch for Groves though and perhaps that’s what this is really all about. But that factor doesn’t work out well for him either as there’s more in it for Froch if he looks elsewhere towards his Vegas swansong…Posted December 2, 2013 9:25 am
Ugsly Pugsly: Lol @ Honour. Froch can’t stand Groves – where was all the “honour” before the fight?
With all the bad blood that happened before the fight, not giving Groves a rematch will hurt Groves (emotionally) more then any punch will.
When Joe Cal beat Hopkins, Hopkins called for a rematch but after saying he “would never lose to a white boy”, he had Bob Hope and No Hope of getting a second fight.Posted December 2, 2013 7:58 am
Froch MUST fight Groves again or his legacy is destroyed.Posted December 2, 2013 5:33 am
…and my prediction if there is a rematch is that Froch will stop Groves in latter rounds. He took a hell of a lot of good right hands and still came on strong. He would be better prepared next time round, less complacent. But I want to see it happen not just imagine it.Posted December 2, 2013 5:04 am
The groves stoppage was bad. A ref mistake. Anything that could have happened after that is speculation. Groves deserves a sporting rematch. So does Froch for that matter. If Froch doesn’t offer one, it speaks not well of him. But he is not compelled to do so. The spectators at the fight spoke loudly about it and Froch would be seen as less of a warrior if he does not heed their call.Posted December 2, 2013 4:56 am
Froch wants Ward.Posted December 2, 2013 4:42 am
Freddie Roach Ate My Hamster
Groves deserves a rematch as much as Robin Reid deserved one with Calzaghe – that didn’t tarnish his legacy in the long term (but did for a few years).
If Froch is chasing a Ward rematch then it’s hard to argue with. Ward is THE test between MW – LH and the outstanding blemish on his record.Posted December 2, 2013 4:32 am
Frochs reputation is not on the line if a Groves rematch isnt made…look at Frochs opponents look at Groves. Froch took him lightly and neally paid dearly…Froch by KO in a rematch.Posted December 2, 2013 1:25 am
Froch stops Groves in any rematch… The reasons are: greater strength, toughness, stamina, and sheer guts and grit… But he already beat Groves legitimately… I’m sure he wanted to ice Groves for the count but the referee stopped him from doing that.
The referee made a judgment call … and he moved to save Groves from suffering permanent damage from the fight… There’re MANY early and late stoppages in Boxing because each referee uses his individual judgment as to when a boxer is in serious danger of suffering permanent injury … Foster is a championship fight caliber ref.Posted December 2, 2013 12:47 am
Spooky Tooth: Froch got a tarnished victory with the help of a terrible, indefensible robbery stoppage from a virtually incompetent ref. The reason he gives Groves the rematch is because he should have a sense of honor. It’s not just that Groves deserves better than he got in the fight. Froch, if he actually has a sense of honor, should want a legitimate win over Groves rather than a bogus one. The ‘reasons’ you see for Froch not taking the fight are also the ‘reasons’ why his legacy will be, perhaps not ruined, but certainly tarnished by his lack of sportsmanship and his willingness to steal a win when he was getting handled in there by a superior fighter. Fans rightly find LL a little suspect for retiring without giving Vitali a rematch, and that did tarnish his legacy a little bit. But as least LL had a legit stoppage. Froch’s bogus win is much worse, and if he retires without rectifying he’s a chump and so are his enablers like you.Posted December 1, 2013 10:51 pm
I think Froch NOW sees the finish line of his career rapidly approaching and wants a big name, big-money opponent in a winnable fight. And Groves isn’t it.Posted December 1, 2013 10:50 pm
Excellent article mate, very captivating and well thought out and fluid. If you ain’t already a columnist then you bloody well should be old chap. :-)Posted December 1, 2013 8:36 pm
All this is said though, with the assumption that Froch has one more fight at SMW, and one at LH and then retires.Posted December 1, 2013 8:33 pm
Ugsly Pugsly: The point I was trying to make is that the rematch would be more likely to happen if they were at similar stages in their career, but what with all the bad blood before the fight and what happened during it, I can see many more reasons for Froch not to take the fight then to take it. I can’t see how one fight he might not (and I dont think he should) take, will ruin all the stuff he did before that – not in the long term anyway.Posted December 1, 2013 8:18 pm
Rotten Tooth: leave the cowardly rationalizations to Froch’s management. Froch has shown toughness in the ring and had a great run but if he doesn’t rematch Groves he’s a chickensh#t wanker. If DeGale keeps winning he’ll be sure to fight Groves again, in any case. And if I recall correctly there was no bogus ref stoppage in that fight nor any real controversy as to the outcome. Bad analogy.Posted December 1, 2013 8:11 pm
Bogus stoppage. Deluded and arrogant fighter (Froch). Unconscionable ignorance if you think this was anything but a robbery. Froch should be booed out of the ring the next time he fights if he doesn’t rematch Groves. He either does the rematch or he’s a coward.Posted December 1, 2013 8:08 pm
Groves owes Degale a rematch more then Froch owes Groves. If Froch was 25, or if Groves was in his 30’s, then a rematch would be in order, but their careers are going in different directions, it would make no sense for Froch to run the risk of losing to a Groves who will box more to a ensure he gets a points victory. Even if froch made it a war, it will be yet another war for an even older Froch. Time catches up with everyone eventually.Posted December 1, 2013 7:57 pm
In the past Froch has been reluctant to step up to 175 and face Hopkins, because he feels the light heavyweights will b too big for him. If he doesn’t want to tangle with an almost 50 year old Hopkins, I can’t see him challenging Adonis or Kov. GGG shud stay at 160 and wait for Sergio. Nobody wants to see him face JC junior either. …this leaves Ward and Groves. A rematch with George, and if Carl can win, and that’s a big if, then he can finish his career with a massive fight, maybe even in the UK with SOG.Posted December 1, 2013 7:54 pm
Only an idiot who knows nothing about boxing could be surprised at how the fight went between Froch and Groves. Froch is made for Groves to put it simply, Groves is a great reactive fighter who reads his opponents well, Froch has such poor skills, telegraphs every punch he throws so badly and is so slow Groves can read him with his eyes closed! There’ll be no rematch if Froch’s team are smart. Groves will be the first to knock Froch out if they face each other a second time and end Carls career!!!Posted December 1, 2013 7:49 pm
A rematch for what reason? Groves was stumbling about like a Saturday night drunk and still had 3 rounds to go. Groves turned his back twice through fear of an onslaught. Groves was spent, Froch is proven to fire bombs all the way through 12 rounds. It was obvious Froch was going to win (in Rnd 9) with or without an early stoppage. As a fan I would enjoy watching a rematch as this fight was entertaining. With no element of surprise for Groves though, Froch would end it much faster.Posted December 1, 2013 7:10 pm
BILLY NO MEDALS ALL AMERICAN BOY
its not frochs fault the ginger winger chose to give the ref a cuddle,froch owes him noutPosted December 1, 2013 6:58 pm
Total rubbish. If froch moved up and fought kovalev or stevenson next then no one except groves would hold it against him. He doesn’t owe groves a rematch and it’s not froch’s fault the ref jumped in early.Posted December 1, 2013 5:57 pm
Groves definitely deserves a rematch.Posted December 1, 2013 5:39 pm
P.S. I say that as a big fan of Froch. He’ll be not only letting himself down, but his fans down too, if he denies Groves the rematch. There is unfinished business there. It’s as simple as that. If he doesn’t fight Groves again, unfortunately a lot of people will remember him for “ducking Groves” rather than for the fantastic career he has had up till now.Posted December 1, 2013 5:32 pm
How would Froch have felt if Kessler had denied him a rematch? Come on Carl. Do the honourable thing and give Groves the rematch he deserves.Posted December 1, 2013 5:29 pm
Froch can fight Ward in a rematch, Kessler in the rubber match, winner of Bute and Pascal for a rematch. He has a couple of options. GGG. I have seen Froch look terrible to only come back and KO his opponent. Froch isn’t fighting bums neither, well for the exception of Bute. Everybody else has been pretty much an A level fighter or an Elite.Posted December 1, 2013 4:49 pm
Anyone who thinks Froch has loads options in terms of fights is either delusional or simply watched the fight with their eyes closed. Froch looked terrible and old in that fight. A fight with Ward would end in Froch getting ko’d- Froch knows it all too well, hence why the fight wasn’t made earlier. Chavez is a no go, Stevenson would annihilate him, and Golovkin isn’t going to step up to super middleweight. The only fight that’ll make him money and the only fight out there for him is a rematch with Groves. Either that or he should should retire.
Froch lost a lot of fans with some of the things he said after the fight. Anyone who saw the fight knows he was having his ass handed to him, and that the ref was wrong to stop the fight. To flat out lie and say he had clear shots when Groves’ hands were up was stupid. In the build up he was talking about wanting to put him to sleep, then after the fight he acts like he was concerned about his future career?… Please. Rematch or retire- that’s all he’s gotPosted December 1, 2013 4:44 pm
Niether men should get hung up on a rematch and let it drag on and on,groves has put his self right up in the SMW scene may be the winner of Bute and pascal or even Ward or Hopkins he’s got loads of options,Eddie hern will find Carl some more bums and hasbeens to cash out on.Posted December 1, 2013 4:16 pm
The reason why Taylor didn’t win more convincingly against B Hop, is because Froch ruined him. He beat him so badly it affected his earlier career.Posted December 1, 2013 4:03 pm
Taylor should of lost both of the Hopkins fights. After he fought Hopkins, Taylor was never the same. Hopkins ruined Taylors career.Posted December 1, 2013 3:35 pm
Enzo…Lol :) …Yep Reid was about as experienced* (*shot to pieces) as the Toney that just got whupped in Prizefighter… And Taylor had just got pummelled twice by Pavlik, who, a post Calzaghe Hopkins went on to destroy….. When you next look at a list of the greatest fighters of all time, I’m sure Taylor will be ranked way ahead of Bhop.Posted December 1, 2013 3:13 pm
I think Froch will be remembered by fight fans, for his fights. Others may well remember him for on-line arguments in relation to him.Posted December 1, 2013 3:08 pm
That article was spot on. Froch has clearly looked at the fight a few times and realised he was lucky, and would be unlikely to get lucky in a rematch. Talk of a fight with Cesar-Chavez is ridiculous and considering Froch protests his next fight is to secure his legacy, I am at a loss to see how Cesar-Chavez can contribute to that Legacy. The warrior that says he will fight anyone needs to stop making excuses and step up. He is ruining his legacy, and only a rematch will appease the British Boxing publicPosted December 1, 2013 3:05 pm
Great article. Froch needs to do the rematch. Even if he gets knocked out e wil be remembered for ducking no one or by passing no one like amir khan has al his boxing career. If Froch was to face Adonis Stevenson that would be an amazing fight. For that fight I would forgive him for by passing Groves.Posted December 1, 2013 3:03 pm
Taylor beat Hopkins twice and Froch then KO’d Taylor. That makes Froch over twice as good as Calzaghe. Adding to the fact that Froch stopped a very experienced Reid while JC scraped passed a near novice version, only multiplies this fact.
I spoke to JC recently and he said that ‘Frank wouldn’t let me anywhere near Froch and I certainly didn’t complain – he’s clearly better than me, my career’s all been smoke and mirrors’. He then added:’Froch is brilliant!’.Posted December 1, 2013 3:00 pm
Froch’s legacy is cemented as a guy that can’t beat Ward.Posted December 1, 2013 2:59 pm
Froch will give Groves a rematch and take care of him very quickly this time around. Froch was coming on very strongly and it wasn’t his fault that the ref stopped the fight. What was Froch supposed to do? Say that the stoppage was too quick and ask the ref to let the fight continue? Froch has provern himself again and again fighting the very best in his weight class. How would Groves have done if he had fought those very same guys?Posted December 1, 2013 2:59 pm
A few months ago Froch claimed his resume was better than Calzaghe’s and every other British boxer, apart from Lennox. ….. Calzaghe became the Ring champ in TWO divisions and in the final year of his career beat a prime, undefeated Kessler and then Hopkins in Vegas. A year on from those fights and Mikkel and Bhop were still the top dogs at 168 and 175. If Froch were to retire today – he has never become a Ring champ. At 168 the Champ is SOG and at 175 it’s Stevenson. Froch is an excellent fighter…but has beaten neither.Posted December 1, 2013 2:49 pm
Froch should rematch Groves just to shut the whiner up and stick it to all the sickly Groves fanboys that are crying about Groves not having what it takes to get the job done against Froch.Posted December 1, 2013 2:45 pm
Who the hell wants to see Froch fight Julio Cesar Chavez Jr??!… An average, former middleweight alphabet champion. …In the UK Carl will make shed loads of money against pretty much anyone at the moment. So, money aside, fights with Groves, GGG, Ward or even Stevenson are all surely much more intriguing fights, that could all enhance Froch’s reputation. Beating JCC Jr will add nothing to Carl’s resume.Posted December 1, 2013 2:42 pm
Froch may have stopped Groves, but he lacked confidence; he didn’t believe and had the wrong attitude in the build up. I just felt Groves’ work was better.Posted December 1, 2013 2:37 pm
froch is a good fighter but not brilliant, has never had a sound defence and that’s his and McCrackens fault.groves will become champion in 2014,Posted December 1, 2013 2:18 pm
His reputation does not rely on any rematch. His reputation is already cemented. Man is a warrior.Posted December 1, 2013 2:07 pm
Bad stoppage Grooves was still throwing punches but I think Froch would have KOed Grooves anyway regardless of the stoppage Grooves was dead tired. Should Groves get a rematch yes but risk vs reward not enough cash